the geezers plug chop!!

[geezer]

first off i would like to explain to you what a plug chop is. plug chopping is another way to tune a carburator to deliver to the engine the proper amount of air and fuel. when an engine is running rich, as in to much fuel inside the motor, your spark plug will look black when you pull it out because its actually unburned fuel or soot actually. this is a waste of fuel and can hurt spark plug life because eventually you will foul it out and the spark will not ignite the mixture properly. now a white plug is an indication that you running the thing to lean. running an engine to lean, or in other words not using enough fuel, can have some very serious side effects. without enough fuel the engine will actually run hotter than usual because fuel not only gives the engine its power but it also acts as a coolant inside the cylinder. so in essence its kinda like running your car low on coolant. if you run lean enough major engine damage will result.

in order to get this air fuel mixture spot on where it needs to be you need to use the plug chop method or an exhaust analyzer. well i dont have one of those lol :lol: so in order for me to tune the bike ill plug chop.
you can do this on your bike stock or modified. but im doing it because i have added a high flow airfilter and muffler. so what do you think i just did to my air/fuel ratio? i leaned it out because now the engine canget more air in so i need to add more fuel now too.

[geezer]

you must start by doing the open throttle circuit first (MAIN JET) so after gettng the bike warmed up on the old spark plug, shut it down and remove the bolts holding the tank down and remove [attachment=1:1pi3cbgh]DSC09762.JPG[/attachment:1pi3cbgh]the engine shild covering the spark plug. remove the old one and put in the new properly gaped one (.024-.028in) then push bike out to the street and once youve got a clear shot start it and go WIDE ASS OPEN! ride it like you stoll it for as long as you can, then hit the kill switch and stop. remove the spark plug and inspect.[attachment=0:1pi3cbgh]DSC09763.JPG[/attachment:1pi3cbgh] mine was still looking lean and i already installed a 136 main jet so now i gotta get me a 140 and retest. i cant move on till i finish with the main jet so

to be continued... i hope i did a good job i aint much of a teacher lol if you got questions or im wrong about someting let me know

[geezer]

reason i removed the tank bolts was to make removing the spark plug easier so that way you could lift it up a bit to fit your 18mm socket extention and rachet in there. also dont even come close to torquing the test spark plug! remember this is a hot engine and the threads will be more than happy to strip fo ryou! just alittle more than finger tight will work for the small amount of time its in there. it took me a few passes to finally get a defenate white mark on my plug so do the chop as many times as you see fit. remember fire it up got wide open as long as possible then kill switch it off withought leaving ful throttle.

[Water Warrior 2]

I would think a steady speed of 60 mph would be more representative in everyday riding. Better results would also happen if you are able to shut the throttle, kill the engine, pull in the clutch at the same time and coast to a stop. Not always possible but give it a try if able.

[blaine]

I would think a steady speed of 60 mph would be more representative in everyday riding.
A steady speed will only check your mid-range,which is controlled by your needle jet,which will tell you if you need to shim it (raise it) to be richer,or lower it to be leaner.Your idle to 1/4 throttle mixture is controlled by the pilot jet. ( Idle mixture jet).You use same procedure,just different throttle position.
:) :cool:

[blaine]

remember fire it up got wide open as long as possible then kill switch it off withought leaving ful throttle.
30 seconds to a minute is plenty to get a reading.In case you are running lean, you don't want to cause any damage.
:cool: :2tup:

[geezer]

sounds right blain, i had to ride the bike back and forth 4 times to get a good reading from the plug. looks like im going to try a 140-145 mainjet and i really think thats gonna do it. on the highway tonight it was really having a hard time keeping speed and i bet its cause the cold air is making it run even leaner. i cant wait to see what hapens

[geezer]

btw water warior, like blain said. the purpose of a plug chop is to see what the engine is getting at one specific throttle angle, not engine speed or vehicle speed. at wide open the carb is using mainly the main jet so thats how you tune just the main jet

[Water Warrior 2]

btw water warior, like blain said. the purpose of a plug chop is to see what the engine is getting at one specific throttle angle, not engine speed or vehicle speed. at wide open the carb is using mainly the main jet so thats how you tune just the main jet
I stand corrected. Using the main jet makes more sense than my idea.

[geezer]

oh dont worry im just readin this stuff off the internet myself :)

[Water Warrior 2]

oh dont worry im just readin this stuff off the internet myself :)
What, me worry. Never. ............... well almost never.

[geezer]

tuesday ill go order me up some 140 to 145 main jets and continue the tuning

[jonathan180iq]

Your testing results should give you accurate information.
But for what it's worth, I don't think anyone has ever used a main jet larger than 140.

[geezer]

BLAINE!! wasnt your bike using a 145? i hope all it needs is a 140 but i have a 136 in it right now off my fzr and its showing me lean, pretty darn lean so well see

[blaine]

BLAINE!! wasnt your bike using a 145? i hope all it needs is a 140 but i have a 136 in it right now off my fzr and its showing me lean, pretty darn lean so well see
No,I ended up with a #136. A #140 was a little to rich.But I'm at sea level. :) :cool:

[geezer]

hmm i see. well maybe i should use a 140. well i have to get it first so that way i can show you what the plug looks like, stay tuned

[Rookie Rider]

Boy i have alot to learn cause i have no idea what you guys are talking about. lol. But im learning a little from you guys since i joined this great forum, and thats good enough for me.

[geezer]

well thats good rookie. im glad to help. i have ordered jets from 140 to 145 ill have em thursday so expect some results on friday or this weekend

[Rookie Rider]

I'll be waiting, after all, im addicted to this forum. lol

[mrlmd1]

RR - get off the computer and get out for a ride. You'll learn just as much with more seat time.

[Rookie Rider]

I hate the sun beating down on me, im a wuss !!

[geezer]

alright i just went and picked up my main jets :biggrin: 140, 142.5 and 145. here are some pics of whats going on. this little set of shortie screwdrivers are great for motorcycle work and make mixture screw adjustments a breeze[attachment=2:1lswsns3]DSC09769.JPG[/attachment:1lswsns3]here is what main jet looks like for those who dont know :tongue:[attachment=1:1lswsns3]DSC09772.JPG[/attachment:1lswsns3]here is what it all looks like takent apart. takes about 10 mins to get here, so awesome[attachment=0:1lswsns3]DSC09771.JPG[/attachment:1lswsns3] well im getting it back together and going on the test ride ill have more pics then

[geezer]

after installing the 140 main jet the plucolor indeed to a bit darker, so this is working! how cool! next up is the 142.5 :biggrin: was kinda hoping the 140 was gonna work i dont wanna tearit down again hahaha

[geezer]

i had a change of plans and went straigt for the 145 i was getting tired of riding the poor bike so hard so i decided to speed things up a bit. good move cause the plug came out lookin perfect check it out[attachment=1:1uym3l76]DSC09776.JPG[/attachment:1uym3l76] and here is the tool you can use to make changes without removing he carb :)[attachment=0:1uym3l76]DSC09774.JPG[/attachment:1uym3l76]
so im finally done with the main jet circuit! :smallrawk: now to tune the midrange.....

[blaine]

so im finally done with the main jet circuit! :smallrawk: now to tune the midrange.....
Only thing I needed to do to my needle jet was move the factory washer to raise the needle in the jet.
:) :cool:

[geezer]

remember jose's thread? he had to cut off the top of the needle cause he moved it out so freakin much. i gotta go find that thread an see what he did.

[geezer]

alright so i am finished with the needle circuit and now it pulls really smooth and the plug looks good. here are pics of how easy it is to get the needle stuff out[attachment=2:1o1tce54]DSC09777.JPG[/attachment:1o1tce54][attachment=1:1o1tce54]DSC09778.JPG[/attachment:1o1tce54] so then to makes ure i was at the right throttle amount i just stuck some tape to the handle and switch pod that way all i had to do was ride down the street and hold it there[attachment=0:1o1tce54]DSC09779.JPG[/attachment:1o1tce54]

[blaine]

Did you need to raise the needle very much? :??:

[geezer]

ended up getting another washer about half the size of the one thats in there. after doing what jieme did the bike would not even start so i backed it off quite a bit. also i regret to inform everyone but all this was really for nothing. bike aint any faster might be if im running around at full throttle but other than that.....oh well at least i never fell into peer pressure and give up :lol:

[mrlmd1]

Never give up on an idea unless you can prove to yourself it won't work. Great effort. :2tup: :rawk:
Are you going to go back to stock now? :poke2: :poke2:

[blaine]

Never give up on an idea unless you can prove to yourself it won't work. Great effort. :2tup: :rawk:
Are you going to go back to stock now? :poke2: :poke2:
He didn't say that it didn't work.He said the bike was not any faster.I never said any of the mods would make the bike any faster.I have stated many times that my bike ran better,started easier,and had more power for hills,& cruised easier,especially with the 16t sprocket.But faster,"not" going to happen.All this worked well for me,because most of my riding was at cruising speeds out on the open road.
:) :cool:

[geezer]

well truth is the bike now has a very slight surge to it at part throttle cruise so im going back down to the original setting on the needle, just the washer. also i might go down to the 140 main jet and see what its all about. yeah sure the bike feels a bit better up hills but sometimes theres a car in front of me and we all know that they really cut the wind drag for us so hmmm i dont know :cry: the little tweeks i did to the bike made no noticable increase in power or throttle responce, and now im running so rich i have some lag when i first hit the gas. this morning it didnt even start, i had to take out a turn on the mixture screw and then it fired up. im bringing the poor thing inside now to rectify my mistakes. and on that note, im glad i did it and i learned alot from this bike. So Mr. L no im not going back to stock, first off i cant cause the new muffler is welded on, not to mention you have to cut the old one off. then there is the lawnmower nasty sound it used to make lol. also the intake sound it makes with the new filter is nice and throaty. so no im not going to stock but back at the settings i had it on. i just thought a 4 valve 250 would have more power on tap and it just needed some choice mods and tuning. :itsokay: WRONG!!

[mrlmd1]

Doesn't "i regret to inform everyone but all this was really for nothing" mean it didn't work? What was he trying to accomplish? Wasn't he trying to make the bike faster or better in any way? His words - it was all for nothing, not mine. And he is being honest about it and telling the rest of us. By all this for nothing seems to mean that nothing was accomplished with all his hard work and persistence.
I'm not criticizing him for doing this, I am really congratulating him for seeing all this through, and he came to his own conclusion which some members on here maybe would have anticipated or at least have been wanting to see some positive result so this knowledge could be passed on to someone else who wants to do the same thing. I sincerely applaud his effort and how he went about this, but I believe this shows that trying to get any significant "more" out of this engine, with his mods at least, is not really going to happen. I would like to see what happens to his gas mileage with all he has done. Again, thanks for the effort and I think it was done in the right way.

[geezer]

no need to argue fellas :) short answer to everything; bike was super shitty bone stock, i hated the way it sounded, buuuut it never gave me any issues. i like where i had the bike prior to my plug chop with the 136 main and washer on the needle. ill play around with the mixture screw to get ride of a funny starting issue, its hit or miss. yes this info i will preach like a bad sermon to all who wanna try it. but its there decision to do it. now you never know, someone else might find the magic "GZ" spot. haha funny.

[mrlmd1]

You may find that sweet spot you are looking for if you keep going. Otherwise get it running right and accept it for what it is. Or get a bigger bike. I went from the GZ to an S50 and really like that bike (one of 3 I have now, all different),
BTW, what part of GA are you in? As hot up there as in FL?

[geezer]

no not anywhere near as hot as florida. im in north ga. i was in tampa a month ago and it was bad, real bad. ive had plenty of bikes. truth is im not a beginner class rider. in the past ive owned an fzr 600, xj 750, xvs 650, ninja 600. the gz is my ex girlfriends and has become by test bed lol. she hates the fact that im messing with it but if she has a problem shes gotta deal with it. i wont let her touch the bike till she at least has a permit. bike i own now is an fzr 1000, and i havent riden it in over 4 months. due to money issues and i dont even have a car right now so its all gz, all the time lol

[geezer]

hey mr l, my fuel economy went up from 64 to 67 mpg! im so stoked about that. so looks like i was correct in my thinking, more fuel to the engine = less throttle application= more fuel economy :biggrin: well how about that? :2tup: just incase your curious my bike is usually going up hill and running at 60mph.

[mrlmd1]

If it's working well, performing well, then be satisfied that you accomplished something and stop screwing with it and get out and ride!

[geezer]

absolutely done screwing with it. it starts up good runs good and gets good, im pleased.

[geezer]

btw, i have put over 4000 miles on the bike in 3 months of ownership. so dont worry i get out and ride it :2tup:

[blaine]

absolutely done screwing with it. it starts up good runs good and gets good, im pleased.
Your head gasket o.k. :??: :)

[geezer]

showed it to a freind and he said its just breathing. not a leak but some seeping. i hold judgment for now. but i took it on a ver y long ride straight up a mountain and sure enough theres oil on the fins.... oh well

[blaine]

showed it to a freind and he said its just breathing. not a leak but some seeping. i hold judgment for now. but i took it on a ver y long ride straight up a mountain and sure enough theres oil on the fins.... oh well
Maybe you can get away with torquing the head bolts.There are a couple of nuts at the base of the head that have a habit of coming loose.IIRC one in front of the carb & another on the front in between the exhaust pipes.
:) :cool:

[geezer]

alright thanks ill look.