Soon to be new rider.

[afflo]

Hello everyone.

I posted a similar introduction in the Rebel250.com board, with similar questions.

I'm a soon-to-be first time rider, and am looking at a GZ250, V Star/Virago 250, or possibly Rebel as a first bike. I do have a ton of questions about the bikes though.

Initially, I considered buying a high mileage scooter for the cheap mileage from driving between my home and work (about 10 miles). However, after giving it more thought (and surprising at the suggestion of my very awesome wife), I decided that I'd rather have a real motorcycle.

Being that I'm a married man with kids, I'm a bit less of an adrenaline junky than the typical person my age (mid 20's), which may come with being married for 6 years and having two kids. I'm not buying anything until I complete the MSF course and get my operators endorsement on my license. I'm definitely more interested in a cruiser than a sportbike. I'm on a waitlist for the course, hoping to get in during the next month or two, and having to come to grips with my general lack of patience.

I'm looking at a 250 class for several reasons.

1. My father in law, the stereotypical old biker dude, said he wouldn't recommend anything over 250-300 cc's as a first bike.

2. The price point. If possible, I'd like to purchase something new rather than used, simply so that I'd know how it had been treated and maintained. I'm one of those meticulous car owners that wants to know that a vehicle I'm laying down cash for has not been abused. Also, on the price point, I'm not looking to spend over 4K at the absolute max. I don't want to have to finance a bike (Between my wife and I, we already have two car payments.)

4. Economy. As stated before, I was considering a scooter, and with the local gas a $4.40/gallon, it would make a nice alternative to my Element. I'm not really a go fast person in general, and despite being warned of their underpowered nature, the engines in my 4-cyl S10 and 4-cyl Wrangler never bothered me.

Now, the concerns:

1. I'm 6'1, with a 33" inseam, roughly 190 lbs. Size 12 shoes. I want to make sure that the GZ250/Virago/Rebel will be large enough that I'll enjoy riding it. How does the GZ compare to the others in the comfort for taller riders department? In looking at them side by side in a showroom, the GZ appeared to have more distance between the seat and pegs than a V-Star 250.

2. I've often heard that people "outgrow" their 250's very quickly. That makes me worry that I might sink money into a new Rebel and become disenchanted with it, only to find that I can only trade up by taking a depreciation loss. It does seem like a strange thing to tell people though. I don't think anyone ever suggested that I would be tired of my Civic after 6 months, and want to move up to an Impala or F150.

3. Would it be more worthwhile to look into a used bike, perhaps an S40 or a VLX if I could find one at a good price? Here, the desire for something new comes in again. I'm not very mechanically inclined, and don't want to have a "project" that will soak up my time looking for gremlins. I''m spoiled on Honda cars... I expect things to work if treated with care. I'd rather have a 250 that I ride for a few years and buy something bigger later on. I also want to make sure, as stated before that I stretch my $4.40 gallons of gas.

4. How bad is the power on hills. I grew up in Tallahassee, which is more or less flat. Now, living on the central California coast (Monterey area), I see what actual hills are. Most hills would be in city streets... would I have issues, say, on the final part of my commute, a 400 foot climb over the course of approximately 1 mile, the steepest part of which climbs from 320 to 405 feet in around 1/10 of a mile. This is all at low speeds (speed limit 25), but I want to make sure that I'm not going to end up as a hood ornament on a closely following SUV.

That hill, BTW, is why bicycling to work is not even an option!


Also, just opinions here: What are the advantages and disadvantages of a GZ250 vs. a Honda Rebel, Yamaha Vstar 250, and even the Hyosung Aquila GV250 (also caught my eye, though I'm wary of something that has an almost ethereal dealer network)

[JIBTEXHNKA]

welcome! i'm relatively new to my GZ250 and this board but i'm extremely happy with both. i was in your same situation, trying to decide between the GZ, the Rebel, and the Virago. the rebel is definitely less tall-people-friendly. i'm 6' 185 lbs and i don't feel cramped at all on the GZ.

now obviously, the rebel folks are going to tell you the rebel is best and we're going to tell you the GZ is best so in the end you're going to have to physically sit on each of them and decide which one you feel most comfortable on. i think comfort is most important in this situation because all three bikes are pretty similiar performance-wise (not speaking from personal experience here, just what i've heard and read).

1. your father-in-law sounds like a smart man

you skipped number 3, so i'll skip 2

4. i get about 68mpg on my GZ. the gz has a 3.7 gallon tank compared with the rebel's 2.4 (i think?), so that might be something you want to consider.

about some of your concerns:

1. from what i've heard, and from sitting on a rebel, the GZ offers the best riding position for taller riders. but again, don't take my word for it.

2. outgrowing a bike is different than outgrowing a car. if you've never driven a car before and you get inside a (insert really fast car here) and stomp the gas pedal to the floor, you might crap your pants but as long as you've got enough road ahead of you you're going to be fine. on the other hand, if you sit down on a superbike and give it full throttle not knowing what you're doing, things are going to get messy, and fast. smaller bikes are recommended to beginners because they're more forgiving due to the lack of power; after you're more comfortable you might decide you can handle a little extra power and probably have a lot more fun. however, you mentioned you're not really speed-craving adrenaline junkie so you'll probably be perfectly happy with a 250.

4. from my experience hills can be a drag only if you're trying to maintain freeway speeds (65mph+), but other than that they are no problem. a 250 shouldn't have any problem at all maintaining 25mph up a good-sized hill.

i'll admit i've only been riding for a few weeks, so maybe don't put too much stock into what i have to say. just my thoughts on the subject.

[patrick_777]

Welcome!

JIB makes good points all around, so I'll drop in a few cents too(probably all it's worth).

You might consider a used bike with low mileage since you said you're not mechanically-inclined. The idea here is that your engine will already be broken-in which, from most accounts, is somewhat tedious and often involves a lot of fluid-changing, filter-checking and babying around for the first thousand miles or so. However, if you're okay with that sort of thing and you're anything like I was, you will quickly learn to enjoy tinkering around with the bike mechanically.

To address a few of your other questions: You might also want to think about waiting until you get through your MSF class before you purchase. The classes usually have a smattering of Rebels, GZs and other 250cc bikes (although I doubt any Hyosungs), and you can probably get a good feel for each of them there, with a (hopefully) knowledgeable instructor that will answer a lot of your questions. If you're impatient or you found a good deal on a bike you're considering it right now, then you should at least take a day or two, go to a couple of dealerships and sit on some (new or used), and get a feel for the controls, pegs, height and balance. It won't be as good of a test run as your class will be, but it could definitely narrow down your choices.

As far as outgrowing your bike is concerned, that really depends on what you get out of the bike personally. You sound like a pretty frugal sort of guy (not an insult, I'm that way too), and you may actually want to get another bike after a few months/seasons. But, like me and many others around here, you could wind up wanting to keep the 250 around for the mileage and so you can take your time shopping for a 600-800cc bike. You'd still like the 250 because it gives a unique feeling riding a smaller-class, quieter bike that's cheaper to work on than many other larger bore cycles, and frankly, more fun in some cases.

I doubt you'll have a problem with the hill you describe on the GZ at that speed. 25mph is about at the first-to-second gear transition (depending on your oil/sprockets/throttle/blah/blah/blah) and you'll have plenty left after that. Now if the hill was posted 45 or 55, you could be disappointed, but that would be with any 250, not just the GZ.

Try not to compare getting or upgrading a bike to changing cars. It's really not the same. JIB made a good point about the application of power in a car compared to a bike, and it's distinctly different. Power/weight ratios in cars are a lot closer than in motorcycles. The gradual opening of throttle will seem to have a MUCH greater effect on the feel of the bike since there are so many other physical variables in the equation (balance, vibration, wind, etc.). In a car, that all does truly affect it, but it rarely affects you, the driver, which means that those variables can distract that much more and if you're not ready, not expecting it, and most certainly lacking respect for it, it will (as JIB said) "get messy, and fast".

Be careful and keep frugal in your choices. Just because you're spending only around $2000 on a bike, doesn't mean you shouldn't treat it like a $50K car purchase. You've done half the work already by gathering information before you take the leap. You're ahead of most folks already, including some on this very msg board!

Also remember that this, and all advice has been given on a generally anonymous posting on an Internet message forum, take it for that it's worth.

[JIBTEXHNKA]

also... there is a HUGE demand for 250cc motorcycles. look on craigslist and try and find one that's been listed for more than a week; i bet you can't. a lot of people know that 250's are the best starter bike and there are always people looking to get into motorcycling, so it shouldn't be hard at all to sell the bike after a while if you do decide you want something bigger. and if you treat the bike nicely and keep it running well and looking good, you can probably sell it for close to what you paid for it (assuming you bought used in the first place). even if you buy new, you will probably make at least 80% of your money back.

[jonathan180iq]

Originally Posted by JIBTEXHNKA

also... there is a HUGE demand for 250cc motorcycles. look on craigslist and try and find one that's been listed for more than a week; i bet you can't. a lot of people know that 250's are the best starter bike and there are always people looking to get into motorcycling, so it shouldn't be hard at all to sell the bike after a while if you do decide you want something bigger. and if you treat the bike nicely and keep it running well and looking good, you can probably sell it for close to what you paid for it (assuming you bought used in the first place). even if you buy new, you will probably make at least 80% of your money back.

That last 80% part isn't really true with the GZ. You'll be hard pressed to resell a brand new GZ for more than $2500 and they list for $3400 new.

[Sarris]

I guess I took it in the shorts. I bought my 2005 new for $3295 +++. Oh well. I've been had alot worse, but I DO like new bikes.

Also, Jon, I think he was speaking about used bikes, and all small bikes and scooters are selling like hotcakes on E-bay. It is true that the first purchaser of new bikes or new cars takes the most depreciation when they resell.

I love my GZ!!!

[Water Warrior 2]

Welcome Afflo. I have a little experience on the GZ and Yamaha plus comments on the Rebel from test sits etc. First, the GZ is a single cylinder engine while the others are 2 cylinder. The GZ is counter balanced so the vibration factor will be about the same. All are acceptable. The GZ will probably be the easiest to maintain overall. Valve adjusts will be simpler too.
The GZ is the largest bike for comfort and has good ergonomics. The Yammer is not too bad but the Rebel is even smaller and you will probably bump your knees on the handle bars during manuevers. Less leg room also. The GZ is also the largest looking bike with it's larger tank and overall lines.
All 3 are pretty much equal in power and will get you anywhere on your commute with ease. Lynda is the primary rider of the GZ and we are leaving tomorrow on a 5000+ km trip. I do not have any misgivings about the bike's ability to get the job done.
All 3 bikes have been on the market for a long time and continue to be among the best starter bikes and keepers for many riders. Which ever one you pick will work well for you. Keep us updated on your choice.

[bikerbroad60]

Hi.. .just wanted to tell you that if you look around,you will be able to buy a good used GZ250 within your price range. I was interested in a used Rebel, a 1999,with 6000 miles on it,and put an offer on it,which was rejected. Then I found a used GZ,with 200(two hundred) miles on it,for the price I offered on the Honda. The Honda is still sitting in the lot,being sold on commission,as was the bike I bought.I bought the Suzuki,and am glad I did.
It is really nice that you are being careful and want to learn all you can before you buy a bike.The folks here are very nice about helping anyone with a question.
Good luck!!
Annie

[Dupo]

If you are going to take the MSF course before purchasing a bike, you will most likely get to test drive a GZ250 as thats what they use at most facilities.

Personally, it was too small for me. I bought it to learn on and never could get comfortable and im only 5'9". My 750 honda fits oh so much better.

[davidc83]

I am 5'10, 185 lbs. I go to the rallys with the rebel folks. Used to go on my little gz but I purchased a C50 and ride it the long distances now. I rode the little gz 11,000 miles in months last year. and I have put 9500 miles on my c50 since October.

I have sat on the rebel and in turns, the bars hit my knees, and am a little more cruched up on the rebel. The rebels have a little bit more top end, a little more zip on take off. The gz has a bigger tank so can go farther between fill ups. They both get about the same gas mileage. When I keep in under 50mph, I get 90-100 mpg. On the interstate doing 70-75mph, I get about 75mpg. I know I post a little better gas mileage than most people on here, but I have witnesses (members on this forum) and have ridden enough miles to know my mileage.

The seat on the rebels are a little more comfortable but they are little more squirrelly (sp?) with the narrow front tire. I like the look of fat cruisers-that is the main reason I purchased the gz over the rebel. I have ridden the little gz in driving downpours and it is very stable on wet roads and loose gravel.

I get the little gz out once a week and ride about 50 miles just to remind myself how much fun it is to ride. It is a great beginners bike.