Is "All the Gear, All the Time" a minority?
 

After spending a good deal of time this holiday weekend riding around town, I've noticed that the "All The Gear, All The Time" group of riders is definitely in the minority.

I do realize riding is all about how much risk you are willing to accept and I'm not here to tell anybody how to ride, but I've been noticing alot of stuff that just seems downright foolhardy and/or dangerous.

There was one instance of a couple where the passenger was sitting on top of a jacket. The arms of the jacket were just flapping around. I shudder to think what would happen if that jacket got sucked into the spokes.

Then there was the family that was riding down the highway at 65+MPH. Mom and Dad on their HD's with the kids. No face protection/goggles on mom. She had her head cranked at an angle, but how she could see clearly at 65 MPH is beyond me. Kids were wearing helmets, but that was about it. Short sleeves, shorts and sandals completed the rest of their riding outfit.

After having seen severe road rash, I don't think that's a risk I'm willing to take...

I think its part ignorance, part an attempt to fit the "biker" mold, and part "it can't happen to me." Unfortunately, I think a large portion of those bikers who don't wear proper safety gear probably don't survive a crash and later change their ways.

The only piece of safety gear I'm lacking is armored pants. And its not because I'm not willing to pay for them. I'm just a big boy (with a short inseam) and its hard enough trying to find regular jeans to fit me. The local shops are also crap as far as apparel is concerned. I'd be pretty much forced to order online (which would be fine if I were easier to fit).

Yes we are a minority.........few and far between normally. I'd say 90% of the riders near me are all "fair weather" riders. They only ride in the warmer months, and only if the weather is clear and sunny. This past fall and winter, I literally could count the number of fellow riders I saw on the roads with my fingers........for the entire span of Nov-Feb.. All of the morons that come out in the warmth seem to absolutely refuse to wear anything more than a helmet, and most often even that is only a skid-lid. Well, there are the wanna-be racers who buy expensive Suomy helmets and Dianese jackets.......and then ride in sneakers and shorts....... :??: :??: :??: None of the cruiser riders here wear anything more than a helmet, except for the very few all year Harley guys who have to wear gear in the winter so they won't freeze. It's only in the winter that I don't feel like the oddball for wearing gear, when I actually see the other riders out.

Everyone I ride with adhere to ATGATT as best they can, and I personally won't leave the driveway without my full set of riding gear on. I've got full leather and full textile, some of it I got at super-bargain prices, some of it at full retail.....all of it was worth every penny. I came to realize some time ago that I couldn't care less what the other riders on the road are wearing/aren't wearing. If they are comfortable with their skin being shredded and ground off in to the pavement, well, it's just not my cup 'O' tea. Sure, when I pull up somewhere and I'm the ONLY rider wearing real gear, I get laughed at........but I'm laughing right back at each and every one of them.

Trying to look "cool" while riding is a self-defeating practice, image is only for riders who stay on long straight roads.
Ride safe

All a matter of choice of course ...BUT those not having experience with the texture of the road at a good speed really have no appreciation for what it can do..personally i have dumped a bike a few times and know ROAD = HARD and rough. I also Know my own skills and can estimate the skills of the auto drivers and it all adds up to putting as much as you can between the road and you. Let the immortal sport bike riders ride around in speedo shorts and flip flops..

Try Diamond Gusset jeans for motorcycle riders (they have a web site )... cut and reinforced just were we need them ..

Have you actually been laughed at for wearing gear? I can't imagine the type of d-bag it takes to laugh at someone for wanting to be safe.

I agree with everything LN said here. The idea that looking cool is a little opposite in my (and probably many of yours) mind. The fully geared-out rider, IMO, looks much cooler than a dumbass with a tank and flip-flops on...

And yes, even in a vet-vest with war patches all over it, if they aren't wearing much more than jeans and a head-hankey, they haven't learned much from all of their past "experiences".

To answer the initial post, around here, all-gear is definitely in the minority. OK doesn't have helmet laws, so literally 1 out of about 30 cruiser riders wears anything more than jeans, gloves and glasses. The sport riders tend to scale up though, being an upper-class sleeper town here, they afford and most of them cruise in full-face helmets and a nice, armored jacket. I spent about 4 hours last weekend cruising around counting the number of sport-bike riders in full gear (helmet, jacket, pants, boots, gloves) and got to 15 before I quit. This was after about 30-40 bikes total across town. The cruiser riders were MUCH worse off. I actually saw only 1 that was in full gear (not counting myself, natch) and only 5 or 6 that had helmets, gloves and jeans on, but the major majority of them wore next to nothing. So much bare skin showing, they should just flail it off themselves and preserve it for when they WILL need it in the near future.

In a moment of confession, I went out this afternoon (100 degrees) a block down the street to get my cat some food and I went in a pair of knee-length shorts and a t-shirt. I wore boots and a helmet with my gloves though. It wasn't that bad, but I understand exactly what my jacket really does for me in the scorching heat. It keeps the sun OFF of my SKIN. Just those 20 minutes on the road, and I came back almost sunburned on my arms. AND it keeps me cooler by circulating the air closer around me then the great convection oven of the outside wind does.

ATGATT is the only way I can ride. I could ride in jeans and a T-shirt but I can't. Before any ride I pick out the gear for the day and put it on. The older I get the more I value life because I have less left every day. Even a low speed get off or minor bump can hurt without gear if you fall. What value do we put on our health, welfare and quality of life. Dressing up is easier than healing up. Different levels of dress are up to the individual and the amount of risk they are willing to take. It is all about freedom of choice in the end.

I went down @ 60mph, w/ a t-shirt, jeans, and a full face, about 13 years ago. I ground a 3" long flat spot on the chin guard, rashed my elbow, and had some muscle protruding through what used to be skin on my left hip. I haven't ridden without my gear since. I was VERY lucky that I didn't hit the bumper that went over my head. It was attached to the car of the old lady that had just pulled out in front of me. At least I think it was an older lady, SHE DIDN'T STOP! Wear your gear. Get laughed at. Know that you are doing the right thing! (And for those who care, or those who like to generalize classes of bikers, the IMMORTAL SPORTBIKE RIDERS that were previously referred to in this thread are [at least in the places I have ridden] just as likely to be properly clad to ride safely as the cruisers are).

Patrick777------yes, I was being serious about getting laughed at for wearing my gear, in fact, it's happened quite a few times at various locations. Both the cruiser and sportbike crowd have laughed at me for it, and of course there has been more than the fair share of non-riders who point and laugh (parking lots are mean places :blush: )

Here's the laundry list of A-holes who apparently think wearing riding gear is funny :
Harley riders
Harley passengers
Metric cruiser riders
Wanna-be racers on sportbikes they have no control over
cage drivers who are blasting the AC while I sit in the humidity/heat
cage drivers who are blasting the heat while I sit in the cold
rednecks in big trucks
wanna-be gangsters in whatever bling'd out bass-machine they happen to be in
high school kids sitting on the bus

.........I think you get the picture. I'd say 95% of the time, all the negativity is in the summer/warmer months, no one seems to want trouble in the winter. I don't know what ever happened to "ride your own ride". About the only group that seem to enjoy my full gear are the little kids who always make the "pull a wheelie" motion to me as I ride by......and of course they don't like the gear for the right reasons. They just like it 'cause I look like a racer with all my leathers on. Actually, some of the non-idiot sportbike guys and non-moron cruiser guys do give me a little respect for riding all year with full gear, only because they are the few other riders here that also do the same.

On another note, how pissed off would this make you? I went to Wal-Mart Saturday (yes, July 4th and I went to the Chinese base-camp) to pick up some shotgun shells, and when I came out to get back on the Ninja there were 3........yep, count'em, 3 shopping carts in the parking space I was in. Only one was touching the motorcycle, but I mean really, what the hell?!?!?! I hate Suffolk VA :cuss:

Sorry for the little rant,
Ride safe

Who generalized classes of bikers?

The other day I saw a rider with no gear (shorts, T-shirt) and a small child on the back (w/ helmet only) holding on for dear life. It's one thing for the rider to have no gear, but...

Seriously, I've just seen pictures of road rash and heard a few stories. ATGATT for me. My skin is awfully important to me. :)

When I was 16 and immortal I laid my bike down on a black top country road with no one around and riding with out my hands on the handle bars. Front tire hit a chuck hole handle bars turned 90 degrees and slapped me down on the pavement like a mouse trap. I was wearing a brain bucket, t-shirt, jeans and tennis shoes and leather gloves. Amazingly I landed on top of the bike sliding down the road and throwing a rooster tail of sparks. I panicked put my hands down to try and slow the bike roasted my hands in less than a second, when I yanked my hands up my bare elbow touched the asphalt. You could see the bone in less than a second. Since that day I wear a jacket when I ride, it isn't leather but better than bare skin. I always wear gloves, jeans, and leather shoes or boots. This my not seem appropriate to many, but it is what I wear for protection.

I have always worn a brain bucket since I started riding. I personally don't care what someone else wears nor should they be concerned with what I wear.

with the increase in gas prices I am seeing more riders everyday. Almost everyone around here wears all their gear except some of the harley guys. Helmets are manditory in Oregon so everyone wears one. I have been seeing alot of scooter riders with t-shirts and shorts. To me harley, gz250, crotch rocket or scooter road rash is road rash. It doesn't matter what you fall off of. Myself, I won't even go down the street with out full gear.

Here in Arizona, I can somewhat understand the logic behind the reasons that people leave the house without all their gear, since you can overheat in just a few miles on a 120 degree day; I've personally experienced clouded judgement (stalled the bike for the first time in a LONG time and had trouble re-starting it) and weakness at the knees due to the heat a few weeks ago. I still wear the leather jacket and 3/4 helmet all the time (along with my everyday outfit of boots and jeans), but usually don't wear the gloves unless I'm planning on going over 45mph for extended periods of time. I'm sure that, for most of the people I see in sleeveless shirts and bandanas (and usually shorts and sandals for the sportbike crowd), it's more about "looking cool" rather than staying cool. Actually, the sportbikers around here are probably 2x more likely to wear a helmet than the cruiser crowd (who are usually the "midlife crisis" types), but still have on freaking shorts and sandals.

[quote="patrick_777
Who generalized classes of bikers?[/quote]Guess I was being too sensitive to this comment????? If so, I apologize.... to everyone.

I wear helmet and jacket all the time. I don't always wear gloves. I wear boots 95% of the time as I keep loafers at work to change into. When not in boots I am in leather Merrells but they are slip ons and don't give any ankle protection. I wear jeans when I am pleasure riding. For my commute to work I am in Khakis (spelling?) Commute is 4 miles on mostly back streets. I have some Kevlar chaps that I use for hunting that I think will do well for cooler weather.

I always wear a full helmet, boots, and gloves but usually shorts and a t-shirt. I tried wearing jeans and a jacket but got too hot. I maybe wearing the wrong things I don't know. Around here(Kalamazoo MI.) traffic is super light and speed limit around town is 35 mph. Visibility is pretty good around here; there are not a lot of hidden driveways so it is pretty hard to have somebody surprise you from pulling out of a lot. You would have to really not be paying attention.

I have yet to go on the highway but definitely plan on getting heavy jeans and an armored jacket before I do

In the summer, usually only wear T-shirt, jeans, boots, gloves-(not the protective kind) and Always my trusty helmet. winter time leather jacket, and the rest of what I just said other than I wear a better set of gloves.


I know that I could be more protected, but like alot of people have said on here it is all about weighing risks, and in the summer here it is not uncommon for it to be 105 degrees and be like 75-90 percent humidity, and I just can't make myself put on anymore clothes. I know I will probably regret it when I have road rash all over my body but I also have to weigh the risk of a heat stroke sitting in traffic (not really jokin about that).


So like alot of people on here alot smarter than me have said you just have to weigh the risks and decide how much risk is worth it to ya. Just like riding a motorcycle to begin with.


Later :rawk:

P.S. I know I ramble alot sometimes, but usually somewhere in the course of it I usually get to the point.

Let them laugh!

Road rash is treated the same as a burn. When they are in the hospital getting the dirt and gravel scrubbed out og their flesh with a brush and antiseptic they will not be laughing.

I've had road rash. I have lots of riding gear and wear it all the time.

Its all good!
 

Myself, I wear armor. I didn't used to. Before the days of mesh you had a choice in hot weather. Roast in leather or take your chances. I used to ride in a tee and jeans. Then I hit a round stone with my front tire at 55+ on some twisties. My 500 lb bike went flying one way and I went sliding 100 feet across the ROUGH blacktop before I wound up on the grass on the side of the road. Talk about a burning sensation! I left a skin skid mark. My hands, arms, back, legs, knees all were deeply abraded and bleeding. I had tried to roll and move about so as to keep from wearing down to the bone in any one spot. All the wounds had bits of stone embedded in them. My daughters who are 27 and 30 now still remember me screaming as the wounds were scrubbed.



This happened on a beautiful clear day with no traffic on a road I had ridden hundreds of times. I was in the hospital and then recovering for months at home. I still have scars 25 years later. The only thing that saved my face was my full face helmet. My tee and jeans were in ribbons. Now with mesh, I can wear armor and be cool at the same time. If I even think of riding without ATGATT I remember what it feels like to have a 40 grit sanding disk run over my skin... and I put it on, and enjoy the ride.

Re: Its all good!
 

Thanks softie. Stories like that are what keep me putting my jacket, gloves, boots and FF helmet on every single time I ride.

Better yet story's like that are what has convinced me that I am a d@#$a#$ and that I am going payday to shop for whatever protective clothing I can afford all in one check, NO BULL!!!!

The internet has a plethora of great and cheap gear, but a brick & mortar store can't be beat for fitting and most of the times, prices. The Cycle Gear shop here in Tulsa has great sales every day, including "damaged" or "imperfect" items. I picked up my Frank Thomas Rage gloves for just under 50% off because they were lightly scuffed on the knuckle-plate.

Well its very possible that I will order some stuff on the internet but "try it on at a brick and mortar". thanks for the advice and letting me eat crow on my earlier statements, without raking me over the coals too bad. I guess I was just convincing myself that what I was doing safety wise was good enough just so I could wear what I wanted to. After reading a couple of these story's on here and looking at that horrible crash on the post "Wear your helmet!", man that almost made me sick looking at that. And even though all the gear in the world probably wasn't gonna save that dude, it still makes you think don't it.


That is why this website and places like this are great because you can learn something without having to "learn for yourself" sometimes. If you will notice not all but most of the advocaters of ATGATT on here and elsewhere have taken a spill without gear on, which only tells me one thing since I haven't had that experience.


That I am talking out of my a@# and they know what they are talking about. which is why I am jumping the no to very little gear fence.



Later

It's a hard lesson to learn and we may be fortunate enough to learn second-hand from the first-hand experiences of others.

Just look through some medical sites about the process to clean up road rash and replace/regrow skin, it's not pretty and it's life-threatening in a much slower & more painful way than the traumatic and invasive crashes can be.

Check out New Enough.Com. They have a very good reputation and an excellant return policy if you need it. The close out section can be a very good way to save even more $$. Their online ordering is pretty easy and a phone call will get you personal service from helpful folks.

I HIGHLY recommend Newenough.com... got some great gloves and a tank bag from 'em. Super fast shipping, too.

An interesting article I read a while back.

I thought it was relevant to the topic a few posts back.

Top 7 Things That Will Happen in a Motorcycle Crash

Re: Its all good!
 

My girls can tell you a similar story. I had some bone exposed and still have a bit of the street in my back that was missed. Sounds like yours was worse.

Once in a while when its hot I think about not wearing my riding pants for an instant. The memory of scrubbing dirt and gravel out of flesh will come back and I gear up.

If you feel like you are dressed to slay dragons .....

Laughed At
 

I say "better to be safe and laughed at because you have the proper gear, than to be laughed at because you have no face"....I'm still lookig for a good jacket with elbow pads, back padding and side padding...I have a good helmet, gloves, and ankle boots. Just lacking the jacket...it gets SO hot and humid in cajun land I really would like to find a lighter jacket with padding instead of a leather jacket!

Phoenix Jacket
 

I picked up my phoenix 4 jacket(joe rocket) at the local mom and pop motorcycle shop (Phoenix Cycles!) for less than $80. I am very satisfied with it. It comes with a waterproof liner I wear in the morning when it is chilly, and remove for the ride home. This afternoon I rode for 60 miles in stop and go traffic with the temp above 90 and was cozy but not uncomfortable when stopped. When underway the breeze blowing through the mesh was lovely. I'm looking for some ventilated over pants with armor I can wear over shorts cuz my legs do get hot, and I wanna be cool.


I rode all through Europe one summer many years ago, on a BSA 650 Lightning, and I felt like a fool in my jeans. ALL the other riders were wearing full gear. They just looked at me and shook their heads!

Re: Laughed At
 

Take a look at the Olympia jackets. I recently purchased and Olympia Bushwacker jacket that I really like it. Way more comfortable than my other jacket and it has a liner. It's an all weather jacket. One interesting feature is the liner is a zip in jacket.

http://www.olympiamotosports.com/bus...wacker2008.jpg

http://www.olympiamotosports.com/

About two weeks after I started riding...
 

...I flew into Chicago (I live in SoCal.) On the cab ride from the airport I saw two guys on sport bikes with no helmets, shorts, t-shirts and tennis shoes. I realized/remembered at that point - no helmet law in IL! These guys were sort of half riding responsibly (not going crazy fast) and half not (weaving in and out of traffic, yelling and gesturing to each other - looked like they were playing some game but it might be just my imagination.) In any event, I looked around the rest of the week and I'd say at least half of the riders here don't wear helmets. It was kind of like being in NV and realizing prostitution is legal there.

I wear ATTGMTT. (All of the gear Most of the time.) When I ride to work I wear jeans. It's about 5 miles and all relatively tame stuff. When I go out in the canyons, I wear the whole bit. I don't have any noble sentiments or holier-than-thou attitude about it. It's pretty simple - I'm scared I'll fall off and eff myself up good. If the gear actually works, I'll be very happy. I paid about $350 for my jacket $100 for the pants, $100 for shoes, $20 for gloves, $180 for helmet. I generally overpay for stuff, not a bargain hunter. If there was a suit of invincibility, I'd probably buy and wear that.

I ski with a helmet and I ride a bicycle with a helmet. I don't like helmets, but my brain is about the only good thing I have. I ain't gonna make it on my youth and good looks.

I do think if I bite it at 60 into a guard rail, I'm gonna be just as dead as Mr. T-shirt, but with maybe more skin on my corpse. As Sarris said, "Stuff happens!"

Riding to work...
 

I have noticed that, during commuting times, I am seeing more riders with full gear than without. On the other hand, when I go up to the catskills/delaware valley on the weekends, almost no one is wearing full gear.

Just an observation - people are going to do what they are going to do.

As an aside - I taught my wife about the gear, and why it is important. She ow notices every rider we pass, and what they are wearing...

Re: Is "All the Gear, All the Time" a minority?
 

Seems like ATGATT is definitely the majority on this site :).

When my bike is running :roll: I wear everything but armored pants. After shopping for all of my gear a number of sales people told me good denim is decent protection. Not sure how accurate that is, but I kind of believed it. I try to wear jeans whenever I ride, + full face helmet, gloves, armored leather jacket and boots. And that's here in central FL in the summer. It doesn't bother me.

I've gotten used to seeing shorts/tanktops on sportbikes and jeans/vest on cruisers. What I think is really :crazy: is the way people think gear is not necessary on a scooter?! In Gainesville yesterday (there are college kids on scooters everywhere there) I saw a guy in flip flops and shorts, no shirt or helmet, on his little scooter. I'm sorry, going 40 mph on a motorcycle, scooter, bicycle or a floating banana will give you the same results if you hit the pavement. It's either college kids on their 50cc scoots, or seniors on their 600cc Bergmans. There seems to be a mindset of "well, scooters are obviously safer than motorcycles." or something.

Crazy.

Re: Is "All the Gear, All the Time" a minority?
 

roncg,
Yes, for some reason people have a notion that they are somehow safer on scooters and don't feel the need to wear helmets.......who knows where they get that idea from :??:

I'm not trying to push more riding gear on you, but please make that decision for yourself........don't take some salesmans' word on ANYTHING. My experience has been that jeans are just barely better than riding in shorts, but at the same time I've known people who have taken spills while wearing shorts who have made it out with no real damage.......luck of the draw I suppose. Riding, as with most things in life, is all about risk acceptance.........just do whatever you are comfortable with and enjoy the ride! :2tup:

Oh, and good luck with keeping that bike of yours running :tongue:

Re: Is "All the Gear, All the Time" a minority?
 

On very smooth pavement and lower speeds jeans (heavy) might give a bit of protection from abrasion. Not from impact though. On rough pavement think of the jeans saving one layer of skin. Jeans will shred in the first foot or two of your slide. The trick is to be wearing armor when (not if) you go down. :cry:

Re: Is "All the Gear, All the Time" a minority?
 

Denim might be cooler in hot weather but will last about 2 seconds or 2 feet which ever comes first in a slide and totally useless for impact protection. A pair of armoured mesh riding pants are cool, protective and not all that spendy. I have Joe Rocket gear mostly and it is decent quality. 3 pairs of pants. Balistic 5.0, Alter Ego(my fav) and Atomic Jeans. The jeans are heavier denim with armour in the knees and hips. A big + is decent pockets for stuff.

Re: Is "All the Gear, All the Time" a minority?
 

You'll get many people on both sides of this, but some detractors will say that the mesh will simply rip off (or melt onto) your skin taking the armour with it. I can't say I'm one of them though. The impact protection is enough to make me agree with you that these are worth the money. I don't like the idea of a crushed/broken kneecap or hip point. However, I'd really like to see some studies done on these compared to Kevlar[tm:2733napy][/tm:2733napy] and Fightermesh[tm:2733napy][/tm:2733napy].

Re: Is "All the Gear, All the Time" a minority?
 

I think we all need to chip in and buy some different types of mesh gear and let Patrick be our crash-test dummy, then we will know which ones to stay away from. :twisted: :twisted: :twisted: LOL!


But on a more serious note, I have to admit I thought the same thing about the whole mesh idea until I actually got a Mesh Jacket, and I have to say that it seems like some pretty tough stuff. I had this picture in my head of some flimsy mesh material like a laundry bag or something, but the mesh on there seems like it would take a pretty good beating, plus they strategically place it on body parts that aren't likely to be sliding points anyways.


Later

Re: Is "All the Gear, All the Time" a minority?
 

Look, I know I'm gonna stir up some shit with this, but I'm really getting tired of the ATFGATFT discussion. I don't do it, and it's my choice. Quit shoving these horror stories and horror videos up our butts. We/I get it.

In the biker community, it's usually (scared) newbies and (maniac) sport bikers who wear ATFGATFT. Those are the riders who need it most, so please indulge yourselves as necessary.

My point is, when it's my ass, it's my choice; when it's your ass, it's your choice. The prolonged paranoid dialog is just getting very old and is not going to convert any "non-believers".

:skull: :skull: :skull: :skull: :skull: